It's time for a major overhaul of Skoda (and VAG) ICE systems

[brenno]

The MDI comes with a USB cable. At most you would purchase one other cable for the iTurd.

Agreed, it would have been nice had that been the case. Probably a bad salesperson. No USB cable firstly, then the bewilderment that ensued when it wasn't really a USB port as I know it. It doesn't even charge the device! Then the second trip to get the overpriced adapter for the propriety plug.

I can't believe how easy it is in other cars in comparison.

The new Touareg is also getting the RNS 810.

Sure about that? When I looked at the Touareg last year they were using the RNS850.

[Dr Block]

I think we should just resurrect the cassette tape...no cables,USB ports,SD cards, Ipods, etc. Just pop it in and hey presto...music appears!

[Flipper Dog]

Sure about that? When I looked at the Touareg last year they were using the RNS850.

You are correct on this one, the RNS850 will be available with the newly released Touareg in July; the old version RNS510 for Touaregs were stopped production over a year ago.

[teodeh]

The point of the "dock connector" as used in apple gear is that you only use one cable.

If you can do command and control over USB, then great, however you CAN'T do audio over usb (well okay in theory you could stream it over USB, which means offloading the ipod's (typically excellent) ADC to the headunit... but if you wanted to do that, maybe buy a much cheaper hard drive?

VW provide both options, so what are people complaining about?


Also, re. charging: There are excellent reasons it won't charge: It violates the USB spec to pull more than 100mA from a USB port without asking the host controller (which adds a whole lot of complexity and cost to the other end). Devices which blindly pull power could, in theory, damage other devices.

[Maverick]

Agreed, it would have been nice had that been the case. Probably a bad salesperson. No USB cable firstly, then the bewilderment that ensued when it wasn't really a USB port as I know it. It doesn't even charge the device! Then the second trip to get the overpriced adapter for the propriety plug.

I can't believe how easy it is in other cars in comparison.

It sounds like you purchased the optional extension cable that extends the MDI connector.

Standard it comes with a usb cable. The option cable is the ipod cable.

Problems charging the ipod etc came about when Apple changed the specs for charging and removed the ability to charge via the firewire part of the connector but this was years ago. There were a multitude of changes and many of the docking devices around where left unable to charge ipods etc. Volkswagen released a new ipod cable to fix this problem years ago but note that this was not a VW problem but was an Apple change.

Sure about that? When I looked at the Touareg last year they were using the RNS850.

RNS 810 is the Phaeton version, the Touareg is the RNS 850, my typo.

[Maverick]

Also, re. charging: There are excellent reasons it won't charge: It violates the USB spec to pull more than 100mA from a USB port without asking the host controller (which adds a whole lot of complexity and cost to the other end). Devices which blindly pull power could, in theory, damage other devices.

The MDI is smart enough to provide up to 1amp to an ipod or similar device, the problem was that Apple changed the method of charging for newer devices and dropped support for charging on the firewire pins. A new cable fixes the problem or it's easy enough to fix yourself with an adapter cable - heaps of ebay as this caused problems for thousands of products on the market.

[brenno]

If you can do command and control over USB, then great, however you CAN'T do audio over usb (well okay in theory you could stream it over USB, which means offloading the ipod's (typically excellent) ADC to the headunit... but if you wanted to do that, maybe buy a much cheaper hard drive?

I'm not too concerned about sound quality to this degree. As I said before, it's just a standard head unit in the car. They're all pretty horrible. The suggestion of a portable drive is great but it really doesn't do half the stuff a smartphone can do with regards to streaming online sources etc, which I use often.

VW provide both options, so what are people complaining about?

The fact that other manufacturers provide a much simpler setup and that VW's solution is poorly designed and archaic. The fact they offer a sub-standard *option* when others in the sector offer an fantastic solution as standard spec.

Also, re. charging: There are excellent reasons it won't charge: It violates the USB spec to pull more than 100mA from a USB port without asking the host controller (which adds a whole lot of complexity and cost to the other end). Devices which blindly pull power could, in theory, damage other devices.

Works fine on other cars though. What gives?

It sounds like you purchased the optional extension cable that extends the MDI connector.

I'm pretty sure I know what I bought . The extension cable sounds handy though. I guess I wouldn't need it if I could use_a _standard_cable.

Problems charging the ipod etc came about when Apple changed the specs for charging and removed the ability to charge via the firewire part of the connector but this was years ago. There were a multitude of changes and many of the docking devices around where left unable to charge ipods etc. Volkswagen released a new ipod cable to fix this problem years ago but note that this was not a VW problem but was an Apple change.

I was referring to the USB power supply. Why didn't they use the USB power pinouts? Sounds like an elaborate excuse for an issue that other manufacturers have no problems with.

[Maverick]

I'm not too concerned about sound quality to this degree. As I said before, it's just a standard head unit in the car. They're all pretty horrible. The suggestion of a portable drive is great but it really doesn't do half the stuff a smartphone can do with regards to streaming online sources etc, which I use often.

Ok so now you want to stream online sources not just access your iphone.

The fact that other manufacturers provide a much simpler setup and that VW's solution is poorly designed and archaic. The fact they offer a sub-standard *option* when others in the sector offer an fantastic solution as standard spec.

VW's solution may be poorly designed and archaic from your viewpoint but from the viewpoint of the end users and from a technical viewpoint what VW have put in place is second to none from any manufacturer.

Works fine on other cars though. What gives?

Works fine on all other cars or just the select few that you tried with your particular product with it's hardware/software version?

You can ignore the fact that Apple have changed charging specs a number of times if you want but it doesn't change that Apple have done this and it has caused problems with thousands of different products.

I was referring to the USB power supply. Why didn't they use the USB power pinouts? Sounds like an elaborate excuse for an issue that other manufacturers have no problems with.

Maybe because when the first iPoo cable was released Apple's specifications required them to use two connectors (firewire) for charging and they were forced to use another two for charging. It has nothing to do with the connector at the other end of the cable but the wiring on the apple connector end. You can continue to choose to ignore the irrefutable fact that Apple changed the charging specs and with their 4th gen upgrades dropped support for the old standard if you like but it changes nothing. Also they changed it so to actually be able to charge they had to see a signal across the usb data pins.

As for your ridiculous claim that no other manufacturers had problems with this change...

Mercedes Benz - all their ipod cables would no longer work - USD$185 for new cable - Has anyone upgraded their iPOD cable so it will charge new iPODs? - MBWorld.org Forums
Millions of chargers, docks and so forth stop working (including Pioneers) - iPhone 3G doesn't work with millions of chargers - iLounge Forums
Apple screws millions of customers - https://discussions.apple.com/messag...sageID=8430970
And screws more with most hifi interfaces stopping to work - https://discussions.apple.com/messag...sageID=9227714
And so on and so forth but I expect this will fall on deaf ears and once again VW will be at fault......

[brenno]

Ok so now you want to stream online sources not just access your iphone.

It's not hard. Streaming radio via your smartphone is not exactly a groundbreaking idea. It's just something the suggestion of a portable HD doesn't offer.

VW's solution may be poorly designed and archaic from your viewpoint but from the viewpoint of the end users and from a technical viewpoint what VW have put in place is second to none from any manufacturer.

Lol. This little end-user just got told!

Maybe because when the first iPoo cable was released Apple's specifications required them to use two connectors (firewire) for charging and they were forced to use another two for charging.

Did…..you…..mean two for data?

It has nothing to do with the connector at the other end of the cable but the wiring on the apple connector end. You can continue to choose to ignore the irrefutable fact that Apple changed the charging specs and with their 4th gen upgrades dropped support for the old standard if you like but it changes nothing. Also they changed it so to actually be able to charge they had to see a signal across the usb data pins.

OK, so since the changes are made at the Apple 30pin end then the scenario I mentioned above should work. I'll go through it in simpler terms.

Standard USB port --> Standard supplied USB iPod cable --> iPod.

This setup supplies power.

VW MDI to USB cable ---> Standard supplied USB iPod cable --> iPod.

This setup does not supply power.

Now….given all the Apple voodoo pinout trickery and signal across data pins has been retained by the same known good cable, why does this not work? I mean, if it were a standard USB port to standard specs, it should supply power on the pins right?

As for your ridiculous claim that no other manufacturers had problems with this change...

Oh I'm aware that other manufacturers have the same issue. I'm sure there are vehicles out there in a worse position . I'm also fully aware of those that seem to have no problems at all.

I guess this is as perfect a time as any to subtly point out that none of these problems with changes to pinouts would exist if you were able to use the original cable that came with the respective devices

Hopefully it won't be too long until head units start supporting Airplay. Perhaps VW can surprise me. Seeing the iPad being integrated in the Kombi concept car recently certainly raises hopes.

[ben_from_watson]

I'm only new to the forum...but I can't help saying that a lot of music is available through a miraculous invention called radio. When the music sux you press a button which looks for more...

(prepares for incoming)