Biodiesel and your new TDI.

[Ozram]

Transporter,

that first link refers to all the major fuel injection manufacturers agreeing to bio-diesel at no more than 5% in regular diesel. This is true. I have seen the actual statement that is signed off by Bosch, Delphi, Denso, Stanadyne etc.

Diesel engines love bio- diesel. Fact. Diesel engines can be made to run on a lot of different things. The difficult bit is getting it through your injection system. Early mechanical fuel injection pumps seem to be able to handle bio better. Common rail injection equipment does not seem to handle it as well. Contaminate your common rail system and you will need to clean the tank & lines, replace filters, replace pump & high pressure pipe. Replace Rail, injector pipes and injectors. Probably about $7-10,000 including labour to do this repair.

At this point in time I would advise against bio-diesel. I'm sure it will be a good thing in the future with more development and the injection manufacturers improvement in their product.

[Transporter]

Transporter,

that first link refers to all the major fuel injection manufacturers agreeing to bio-diesel at no more than 5% in regular diesel. This is true. I have seen the actual statement that is signed off by Bosch, Delphi, Denso, Stanadyne etc. .

They probably didn't have a choice.

At this point in time I would advise against bio-diesel. I'm sure it will be a good thing in the future with more development and the injection manufacturers improvement in their product.

That makes us 2.

[Preen59]

A point that probably should be made here is that none of our smaller VW Diesel engines over here are common rail yet (as far as i know.. The 2009 stuff might be different). We're still all running PD injection.

This goes for all the 1.9L TDI's. The 2L TDI's including the Golf GT.

So that means that nobody has an engine running ridiculous fuel pressures and therefore it's not as critical. (I however will not be running Bio in my Caddy until it is out of warranty and i can be sure it's 100% safe).


Not sure about the bigger stuff.. Anyone fill in that blank?

[Transporter]

A point that probably should be made here is that none of our smaller VW Diesel engines over here are common rail yet (as far as i know.. The 2009 stuff might be different). We're still all running PD injection.

This goes for all the 1.9L TDI's. The 2L TDI's including the Golf GT.

So that means that nobody has an engine running ridiculous fuel pressures and therefore it's not as critical. (I however will not be running Bio in my Caddy until it is out of warranty and i can be sure it's 100% safe).


Not sure about the bigger stuff.. Anyone fill in that blank?

Bio diesel is as bad for PD injection as for common rail.

[Ozram]

A point that probably should be made here is that none of our smaller VW Diesel engines over here are common rail yet (as far as i know.. The 2009 stuff might be different). We're still all running PD injection.

The new Mk6 is common rail.

I run the PD system in my Caddy. I will still not put bio anywhere near it, primarily because I know what it can do to the newer injection systems and I know how much they cost to fix.

If the manufacturer says only 5% and actually puts a sticker on the fuel flap saying "no bio" and you still want to use it then you are asking for trouble IMHO.

[Ozram]

So that means that nobody has an engine running ridiculous fuel pressures and therefore it's not as critical. (I however will not be running Bio in my Caddy until it is out of warranty and i can be sure it's 100% safe).

The fuel pressure has no relevance. The fact is the tolerances are a lot closer than in older systems, therefore they grind to a halt quicker.

[Preen59]

Bio diesel is as bad for PD injection as for common rail.

My understanding was that PD could tolerate it moreso than common rail because one of the issues was that bio diesel cannot lubricate sufficiently under extreme pressure, therefore the common rail systems would fail?

(Question, not statement)

The new Mk6 is common rail.

I run the PD system in my Caddy. I will still not put bio anywhere near it, primarily because I know what it can do to the newer injection systems and I know how much they cost to fix.

If the manufacturer says only 5% and actually puts a sticker on the fuel flap saying "no bio" and you still want to use it then you are asking for trouble IMHO.

Like i said i won't be letting bio in my tank any time soon...

[Transporter]

Actually pressure in the PD injection system is higher than in the common rail fuel system. Lately piezo injectors for common rail are closer in the pressure to PD system know.

[gldgti]

all this is good discussion, but the question still begs - If all this is true, why are VW's Bio-friendly in the EU?

I postulate that VW certainly do not have different engine components in the euro sold cars. I think its all down to adhereing to fuel standards, rather than some fault or incompatibility between the technology and the fuel itself.

[gldgti]

I need a bit more prove than one member here and there to experimenting with his car before I would use biodiesel.

Something like driving 200,000km using the biodiesel only and under different driving conditions in different climates on more than just one car, than

after that 200,000km dismantle the engine and check the wear on the components and compare to the one driven on the petroleum diesel.

20 engines in the testing like that could give some reasonably accurate data.

But the problem is that the quality of the diesel fuel is not guaranteed, so even such test wouldn’t be accurate.

P.S. Buying biodiesel instead petro diesel when there is not saving (actualy the engine is using more of it) is non sence.
Any car fitted with DPF cannot use biodiesel anyway.

Transporter, please justify some of your claims here.

1) why can a diesel car fitted with a DPF not use biodiesel? it is true that the "regeneration mode" may not work effectively.... nor will the 50% less soot from using biodiesel clog up the DPF so much as normal diesel.

2) it is well known that bio-diesel has been used consistently, over a long peroid of time, and in many climates, in different vehicles, for many years. It is only in Australia that we have so little experience with this fuel. I will concede taht the use of bio-diesel in modern common rail and PD injection systems may not be so well documented, because of their relatively short exposure to th world. many new diesels arent yet out of warranty and many owners have been scared out of using bio diesel.

To others -

It is not sensible to postulate about why bio-diesel "cannot" be used in your vehicle unless you are actually testing it. I'm sure that with some research (particularly with reference to he US, Canada and Europe) that you will find evidence of the successful use of bio-diesel in new diesel cars. - even to the point of VW sponsored racing endeavours with 100% biodiesel vehicles.

what i'm saying is that UNLESS your opinion is based on hard evidence, don't post it as implied fact.

all of the above is meant in the most friendly and informative mannor