what is diesel?

[smithy010]

This forum is right up my alley, I have just done my first small batch of biodiesel. Working on a single tank biodiesel processor, so once i have it perfected and tested (in a mates cruiser), i will be looking for a diesel for my little yellow mk1.
I'll start pushing for some info when it comes closer to the date when i want to give her a heart transplant.

[16valvertwin45s]

Sorry for hijacking this post slightly, but me being a pom and not completely comprehending aussie thinking
Why are diesels so unpopular here?Every 2nd car in england is a turbo diesel long gone are the days when your diesel family sedan sounded and performed like a truck.
Also, in all the time I've been a Golfwagon fanatic I've never heard of a swallowtail before??? apparently its a mk 1,but how ,why and where

[syncro]

Why are diesels so unpopular here?

Diesel is more expensive that petrol here.

Diesel cars are more expensive. Can take 20 years to get your money back.

We have hills.

Also, in all the time I've been a Golfwagon fanatic I've never heard of a swallowtail before??? apparently its a mk 1,but how ,why and where

I've never heard of them either! I thought it was a pommy thing


.

[gldgti]

swallowtail.. the mystery to 50% of golfers, and so friggin obvious to the other 50% they never bother to explain... i dont know either

diesels are unpopular in australia because aussies are very narrow minded folk, generally not willing to change they're ways or take to something new. we are also incredibly predjudiced against the unfamiliar.... sad isnt it?

[16valvertwin45s]

diesels not more expensive here
fuel in general is cheaper here as is everything else
inthe uk diesel is more expensive than petrol and at the mo petrol is approx $2-60 a litre!!
so god knows the price of diesel
and without meaning to sound offhand "syncro" Isaid England not holland the UK is pretty hilly even if its not quite as mountainous as france,austria,germany,switzerland and the other alpine countries where diesel cars are even more popular than the UK

[gldgti]

post hijack in progress... sorry brackie couldnt find the "users online" area of the screen....

16valvertwin45's... your in newy... whereabouts and whats your golf look like... can mollins and i come and see it?

[Golf Loon]

You Loons

Swallowtail is a 1975 German Built Golf, registered in Oz, early 1976.

They are extinct amost everywhere else, as they are so old. They have a different rear panel. Thats the major difference. There are a few others, but thats the most obvious.

See this pic, thanks dubstar



Now go and look at the back of your Golfs. The line on your cars is straight under the lights, whilst the swallowtails curved up more, like a swallows tail.

2 Door swallowtails are quite sought after in the UK and other countries. And pretty rare here too.

Hope that helps.

When I was in the UK, diesel was half as much as petrol, what happened?

[16valvertwin45s]

Too many "DISEASELS" sold so the government took the "initiative" and increased the the price

ahhh! thank god for progress

[syncro]

You Loons

Swallowtail is a 1975 German Built Golf, registered in Oz, early 1976.

I've never seen a '75 here except a private import 1500.

Apparently LNC brought in a few (less than ten) for testing purposes. They came in German colours, mars red, etc.

[imported_brackie]

As for diesels becoming more popular in Oz, yes, the turning point is here now that we have Eurodiesel. I hope that particulate filtration is as effective in the long term as we hope that it will be (Catalyst Thurs. 4th of May). Price of diesel here in Tassie is ~$1.50 per L. Unleaded petrol is cheaper. Premium unleaded is usually about the same price as diesel her in Tassie.

Quote from a French car forum...Submitted by Pug 307

"There are three key reasons why Diesel hasn't taken off in Australia, in my opinion.

1. Lack of general public awareness of current Diesel benefits and product.

2. Lack of mainstream Diesel product.

3. Weak economic incentives to take up diesel.

Fuel Cost: Diesel can be up to 20c more per litre than standard ULP, up to 15c more than premium unleaded (95RON) - this has been growing in recent times. This is unlike many places in Europe where the price differential is negligible or in favour of diesel.

No Registration Incentives: Registration costs for cars are not linked to C02 emissions, thereby removing another economic carrot present in Europe, but not in Australia.

Purchase Premium: $4000 for a Citroën C4. $3300-4500 for a Peugeot 307. $7050 for a Audi A4 and so forth.

When you factor in higher cost of fuel per litre, higher purchase cost, no registration incentives, it's hard to make a purely economic argument for a diesel in Australia, especially considering the average mileage per car in Australia is now less than 15,000 km per year. You have to place a value on the driving characteristics of a diesel. Having said that, the marketers at various marques in Australia know how to seduce people with lower fuel consumption, because people aren't exactly rational with these kind of things

Lets take a 307 for example - XS 1.6 16V vs XS 1.6 HDi.

On the combined fuel consumption cycle.

Diesel fuel consumption: 4.9l/100km
Petrol fuel consumption: 7.4l/100km

Over 15,000km, the diesel uses 735 litres, whilst the petrol uses 1110 litres - another 375 litres.

Today's petrol prices (from the Shell website)

Unleaded - $1.309
Diesel - $1.485
Inferred price of 95RON - $1.369 - diesel premium 12c/l

Diesel Cost: $1091.48
Petrol Cost: $1519.59
Diesel Saving: $428.11
Diesel Purchase Premium: $4500.
Doesn't sound so good now?

But wait, there's more.

Because a diesel costs more, there are interest charges to consider/foregone return on investment opportunity costs to factor in too. Assume a car loan rate of about 9%

That $4500 premium to buy a diesel 307 now costs an extra $360 in interest costs per year.

So that $428.11 saving shrinks to $68 a year. I'm not convinced about any significant advantage that diesel has over petrol in resale for a 307 either. Looking at Redbook's lower bound for the trade in price, on a 2002 307 XS, you will lose $18,190 for the HDi, vs $15,790 for the petrol 1.6 16V over 4 years.

Paying $4500 to save $68 a year?"

He researched that well and presented a compelling case not to buy diesel.

Yes, here in Oz it's difficult to justify the additional expense of buying a new diesel. I came very close to buying a demo Golf 5 1.9Tdi last year. The price differential between the demo diesel and a petrol example had narrowed considerably and would continue to do so over the years. Where the diesel begins to gain ground is in the longevity of the engine. A properly maintained diesel will outlast a petrol equivalent by at least 100%, so as the years go by the diesel becomes more valuable.

As for fuel prices, I think the Europeans are suffering the same pain as we are. Base fuel prices are decided by supply and demand on a global basis. China and India are heavily dieselized and account for an increasing proportion of diesel consumption. This is what is pushing up the world price and all western countries are suffering for it. Until recently the cost of diesel was less than the cost of petrol simply because it comes off at a lower point in the cracking process, but now world economic forces have canceled that advantage out.

Hang on to your hats, guys....This is just the beginning. As demand increases and supply (from both the oil fields and more importantly the refineries) stays the same or diminishes petrol and diesel prices will continue to rise. Globalisation :!:

Taxation. On every litre of diesel (say @ ~$1.50) the Feds take 38 cents in excise and 15 cents in GST. Commercial and off-road users of diesel get this back so that helps. (What doesn't help is that then the ATO adds the excise rebate to your income and then taxes you on it ) So at company tax rates you get hit at 30 cents in the $ tax and the 38 cents excise rebate becomes ~26 cents. The $1.50 per litre diesel will actually cost $1.09. In many European countries I understand that there is some tax relief on diesel at the pump so it's for ALL users. Why not here?
Disclaimer...I'm not an accountant so my numbers may not close.

Hills.
Syncro.. I'm afraid your comment about diesels and hills is no longer valid. Sure, my 1.5 struggles but I test drove that 1.9 TDI up some of the steepest hills in Launceston and it flew up them. There is so much torque that petrol engined cars just couldn't keep up. I suggest you take one for a drive...you'll be amazed.

Sorry to be so long winded on this guys but the diesel vs petrol debate will never go to sleep. The bottom line is you either love them or hate them. I love them.