US based Tuners Pulling Stage 2 / Emissions Systems Modified Files

[tigger73]

There's a number of US based tuning companies that have pulled stage 2 hardware/software - notably APR among others.

It appears that the EPA in the US is going after the aftermarket tuning companies that are putting in emissions defeat devices or removing emissions hardware.

Now that the have gone after VW/Audi, they're going to the next level and going after all the tuning companies.

Settlement with EPA and the Department of Justice Prohibits Performance Diesel, Inc. from Selling Diesel Engine Defeat Devices | U.S. EPA News Releases | US EPA

[HaydEn]

APR UK will stop stage 2 + after September 7th as well.


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[tigger73]

I’m guessing this will effect all regions. I believe APR are looking to undertake their own testing and to get approval to sell/install high flow exhaust systems but these will have to go through a strict emissions testing process which will take time.

In the interim they have pulled all their stage 2 files/hardware from sale.


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[The_Hawk]

It's not a huge surprise. Modern tuning that "doesn't require engineering" has been a huge question mark for me for a long long time. But does it? We have all been aware and/or worried about voiding insurance with the wrong wheels, but not with a tune (as long as you tell the company)... but is it roadworthy?

I did speak to an engineer a number of years ago who suggested that modern cars would likely walk in all the safety testing as even stock brakes and other equipment are pretty good (unlike the old days of drum brakes at all that). The wild card was always emissions. I've often wondered why none of the big names have their stuff pre-engineered and approved so you could buy with some confidence that all was right with the world? Surely it would be a big selling point, buy XXX Tuners stuff as it's approved under ADR... Potentially that would open up the market to partnerships with dealers too since they can now tick more boxes of compliance!

Will be an interesting space to watch.

[Dutch77]

I've often wondered why none of the big names have their stuff pre-engineered and approved so you could buy with some confidence that all was right with the world? Surely it would be a big selling point..

I think because we know just how much it costs to do it properly.

I appreciate there is a lot more to it then just emissions with say the Mustang Type R - but it's a huge cost to buy something fully complianced.

If the EPA would start defecting all the dual cab clowns puffing crap everywhere and driving like they're in a 911 that would be a nice start though.

[tigger73]

I think because we know just how much it costs to do it properly.

I appreciate there is a lot more to it then just emissions with say the Mustang Type R - but it's a huge cost to buy something fully complianced.

If the EPA would start defecting all the dual cab clowns puffing crap everywhere and driving like they're in a 911 that would be a nice start though.

APR are now investing in a test cell/dyno to do the testing in-house.

I agree it’s been a big loophole. To be honest if they were serious about it they should actually make passing an annual emissions test a requirement for registration.

Until they do that there will always be people installing catless exhaust systems and removing DPFs off diesels.


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[Dutch77]

I would go a step further and shift all dual cabs to their own state to leave the rest of us in peace, but I am probably off-topic.

APR has a big enough market stemming from the USA and internationally to invest into it, so if they go ahead then they will be the expensive but potentially legal option. And then there will be everyone else, potentially on the fringes. Although noting The Hawks comments, and how far someone wants to push the 'non-roadworthy' angle claim in legal proceedings.

[The_Hawk]

I've heard rumours over the years that certain model stock vehicles wouldn't pass the emissions (or noise) testing within a very short period of time from leaving the factory floor since they are running sooooo close to the edge and these system deteriorate. Annual testing it's really viable, it's also a hugely variable standard depending on the year it was made, fuel type etc etc making it probably more specialist in nature. I've also heard it takes a decent chuck of time... unless of course a stick up the tail pipe and rive around the block while doing the brake test is enough to get a reading within x% of the "approved" number which is considered a pass. There would be MASSIVE outcry if this meant anything over 10 years old required new cats or other parts on day 1. It might be good for the planet and might be a way to push older cars off the streets, but since these things would likely adversely affect the lower income individuals across the country I can't see the pollies pushing that one too much just yet... maybe as a long term plan.

I do wonder what the costs would be to get something tested and passed. Is it a matter of showing the authority one example? ten? 50? Can they present their own data? Or does it have to be independently tested? This is more out of academic curiosity that anything else. The end user will likely see no change other than a potential increase in cost. It also means that the tuning options may be limited to only the volume sellers (like GTI and R Spec) rather than lower end models where getting something verified probably isn't cost effective for the company. (unless for some strange reason stage 1 falls into some odd category that doesn't require testing and only stage 2+ does?)

Definately a very interesting space to watch.

[tigger73]

Well it's been confirmed that APR is pulling the stage 2 files from early next month here also. So either get it now (and be a dirty polluter like the rest of us) or you'll have to wait/go with another tuner.