Mk7 Golf R Discussion Thread

**Diesel_vert** · 15-12-2013, 07:09 PM

I'd agree with these sentiments.

Difficult it may be to find a more useable, practical, competent, effective and well-rounded range of performance passenger cars than from the Volkswagen Group, I (still) wouldn't say driver involvement is one of their core talents.

Then again, one does not normally buy anything from the Volkswagen Group (at least, from their passenger car division) expecting the ultimate in on-the-limit thrills 'n' spills or 10/10ths driving.

So a valid criticism, but hardly relevant for it's target demographic and market.

**samps** · 16-12-2013, 08:53 AM

Originally Posted by Diesel_vert

Then again, one does not normally buy anything from the Volkswagen Group (at least, from their passenger car division) expecting the ultimate in on-the-limit thrills 'n' spills or 10/10ths driving.

I still think 200kW and 400Nm should be plenty of thrills even at 9 tenths. The S3 felt disconnected from the road, which was surprising to me given the "sports" pedigree of the car.

**Ideo** · 16-12-2013, 09:15 AM

Originally Posted by sameatworld

Having gone from APR stg2 GTI to golf R, I would agree that it's not as fun. Maybe m135i or a45 for out right thrills. I don't think going to AWD is necessarily the way to get more fun esp with haldex (unless the car is mental like a45).

I think "downgrading" would give heaps more fun, such as a fiesta ST. Would love one...

My next car will be a downgrade for those reasons.

A bit over pummeling the road into submission.

**Lucas_R** · 16-12-2013, 09:38 AM

Originally Posted by Diesel_vert

Then again, one does not normally buy anything from the Volkswagen Group (at least, from their passenger car division) expecting the ultimate in on-the-limit thrills 'n' spills or 10/10ths driving.

So a valid criticism, but hardly relevant for it's target demographic and market.

The DSG/S-Tronic doesn't help in regards to driver involvement. Yes the manual is slower in a 0-100kph dash, but how often do you do that? In every other situation, the manual (which is a lovely gearbox) is far more involving to drive, and gives you that connection with the car and control that you just dont get with a DSG, no matter how much you play with the paddles.

**Ideo** · 16-12-2013, 09:51 AM

Originally Posted by Lucas_R

The DSG/S-Tronic doesn't help in regards to driver involvement. Yes the manual is slower in a 0-100kph dash, but how often do you do that? In every other situation, the manual (which is a lovely gearbox) is far more involving to drive, and gives you that connection with the car and control that you just dont get with a DSG, no matter how much you play with the paddles.

Yep. It's a really lovely gearbox to use.

I found the DSG like a computer game.

**Diesel_vert** · 16-12-2013, 10:13 AM

Originally Posted by samps

I still think 200kW and 400Nm should be plenty of thrills even at 9 tenths. The S3 felt disconnected from the road, which was surprising to me given the "sports" pedigree of the car.

There is certainly some giddiness to be had with driving around in a fast car

but it isn't difficult for anyone to make a car go fast.

You have to look at the overall package and how all the relevant factors (engine, gearbox, chassis, suspension, steering, etc) work together to create something which, clichéd as it may be, "feels alive" as a driving instrument - though admittedly, it's a tall order for any modern car these days.

So in this particular regard, Audi's fast car division have been traditionally been strong on engines, but lacking in the chassis, suspension and steering department. That the S3 felt "disconnected" comes as no real surprise to me.

However, it's their other strengths (interior and exterior design, trim quality, practically, on-road performance, badge, etc) which make them generally pleasant and nice cars from an ownership experience point-of-view (as opposed to the ultimate in driving experience).

**Mountainman** · 16-12-2013, 10:31 AM

Originally Posted by Lucas_R

The DSG/S-Tronic doesn't help in regards to driver involvement. Yes the manual is slower in a 0-100kph dash, but how often do you do that? In every other situation, the manual (which is a lovely gearbox) is far more involving to drive, and gives you that connection with the car and control that you just dont get with a DSG, no matter how much you play with the paddles.

+1 for this. 40 years of owning nothing but manuals and this new Golf of mine still leaves me stunned at just how good VW have made a manual to be. I can never get over why the vast majority of drivers choose automatics (and that's what a DSG really is - it automatically changes gears and operates the clutch for you - that to me makes it an automatic). I guess they either haven't learnt how to control a clutch or can't be bothered to enjoy the feedback you get from the clutch/gearshift integration. it's really what makes driving a car rewarding. Automatics with manual shifting and paddleshifts is just switching and no more than that.

**Ryan_R** · 16-12-2013, 10:31 AM

For me 90% of the time in the car I'll benefit more from the outright performance and the great interior + tech compared to the driving feel I suppose. Otherwise you'd see a lot more track-focussed cars on the road.

**Lucas_R** · 16-12-2013, 11:34 AM

Originally Posted by Mountainman

I guess they either haven't learnt how to control a clutch or can't be bothered to enjoy the feedback you get from the clutch/gearshift integration. it's really what makes driving a car rewarding. Automatics with manual shifting and paddleshifts is just switching and no more than that.

People love gimmicks and buttons - which is a factor as to why the DSG is so popular. I'll have a manual though thanks.