Big Brake Kit for the Octavia? (Fits GTI MK5/6 and others)

[Martin]

Thanks guys - they are awesome in looks and brake feel - more pictures to come

The calipers, brake pads, mounting plate and bolts weight 4.2kg (heavier than it feels)
The rotors weight 9.2kg (lighter than they look/feel)
That seems like a good weight for the rotors considering their diameter and thickness

Ok, brace yourself, here is the surprise of the day!!!

The original Skoda (VW) calipers, mounting bracket and pads weighted in at 6.5kg
Good grief Charlie brown - a huge 6 piston caliper is 65% of the weight of the stock single piston caliper!!
(Now I understand why everybody goes on about the weight penalty of using the R32 front calipers)

Now, the rotors:
Those massive HPA rotors are a fearsome lump of metal to hold (for a very short period of time!)
They are the sort of thing a Scott would lug around the moors on each arm when walking into battle (glup).
Drum roll please...
HPA two piece rotor 355mm 32mm thick weighting in at 9.2kg
Stock Skoda (VW) is 312mm diameter and 25mm thick weighting in at 8.5kg!!!

So the all up weight per side is 15kg for the Stock Skoda setup and 13.4kg for the HPA massive brake kit
Clearly the HPA caliper weight and the two piece HPA rotor is what achieved this result
(One piece rotors always have a large weight penalty)
I really did not expect that - it's quite astounding in my view

[Weekend-Warrior]

I'm sure even cheap LCR Brembos will be wonderful

It is a bit of a gamble. They look a bit rough, but hoping it's just cosmetic. Planning to rebuild them.

Not expecting to be able to notice any difference on the street. They may just not fade as quickly, but I haven't found the limits to the standard brakes and it's unlikely I never will. But that's what I was looking for since my wife drives the car most of the time, I didn't want to change the pedal feel or compromise the brakes in any way. I like the short travel and solid feel. It's just for looks and soothes my need to have something a bit different.

[fuzion]

It is a bit of a gamble. They look a bit rough, but hoping it's just cosmetic. Planning to rebuild them.

Not expecting to be able to notice any difference on the street. They may just not fade as quickly, but I haven't found the limits to the standard brakes and it's unlikely I never will. But that's what I was looking for since my wife drives the car most of the time, I didn't want to change the pedal feel or compromise the brakes in any way. I like the short travel and solid feel. It's just for looks and soothes my need to have something a bit different.

There are a few things people tend to forget.

Your brake master cylinder on a gti/v-rs/a3 tq is smaller than what is fitted to an S3, R32, R36, Golf R and Scirocco R. These cars have a slightly larger cylinder fitted to suit the OEM 345mm brake setup. So for anything larger than a 4 pot caliper you ideally would need to upgrade this as your "huge brakes" really are not suited for your OEM Setup - but we all know this right?

All these people putting on these huge brakes expecting massive improvement genuinely isn't necessary.

Everyone is so worried about "weight". But are you on track day in day out, will you be corner balancing your suspension as well for setup to run on the track? Or are you not even going to the track and want it for aesthetics?

Calipers that do not carry a dust boot are also illegal for aussie roads, the reason being clearly they seize and can cause issues. The reason they do not have dust boots (certain types) is more so for track use, where they get rebuilt regularly due to the punishment they cop on the track.

312mm OEM Setup you can go a 4 Pot Caliper from Porsche which for the "right" driver can easily be more than suited for track or road use.

If you wanted more bite, new brake master cylinder with the TTRS 370mm setup is a cheaper and easier option.

Myself i run a 996TT caliper on a 350mm rotor on my S3. Why? Because oem is 345 with a single pot caliper, do you need to go bigger ? Not necessarily, and of course you want to keep that OEM brake feel always. Both cars of ours (mk6 gti/s3) run this setup with a huge improvement, but no difference to pedal feel. When they heat up, i do have to say they become very very sticky and even more responsive.

Grab yourself race tech magazine, as there is some great articles throughout the year related to brakes etc.

Just my 2psi on the subject. Don't always think bigger the better, theories and practise will tell you otherwise. Media and aesthetics make you want all .. Dont get me wrong, love 8 pot fronts, 4 pot rears.. but what for? (Yes they'd look nice lol)

[fuzion]

For a good read about lovely Skoda modding in general this might hit you guys up for a few hours vRSAlex's Octavia vRS Estate - R8 Calipers now on

[Martin]

Your brake master cylinder on a gti/v-rs/a3 tq is smaller than what is fitted to an S3, R32, R36, Golf R and Scirocco R. These cars have a slightly larger cylinder fitted to suit the OEM 345mm brake setup. So for anything larger than a 4 pot caliper you ideally would need to upgrade this as your "huge brakes" really are not suited for your OEM Setup - but we all know this right?

The Octavia VRS brake master cylinder has the same 23.8mm bore as the Audi S3

I can assure you the brake pedal feels great with my HPA 6 pot caliper
Purhaps there is a little more pedal travel
But it has heaps of progression and granular control
At all pressure levels it has heaps of authority - very reassuring

All these people putting on these huge brakes expecting massive improvement genuinely isn't necessary.

That does not really make sense but I think you mean braking distances won't be massively reduced - yes
Nobody here has the expectation of "massive braking distance improvements"
Published testing has showed that braking distances are reduced (even with R32 brakes)
BBK's are great for track days and avoiding brake fade
BBK's are also a presentation item - fine for those that choose to spend their money that way

Everyone is so worried about "weight". But are you on track day in day out, will you be corner balancing your suspension as well for setup to run on the track? Or are you not even going to the track and want it for aesthetics?

Yes, we are worried about weight because it makes a big difference to unsprung weight and suspension performance
We spend most of our time driving on some pretty poor roads with large wheel diameters and skinny tire profile banging through pot holes - we don't want to add a lot of weight to our wheel/brakes

Corner weighting is something you do to race cars - not often done on production road cars
(Unless you have adjustable coil overs there's not much you can do about corner weights on a production car)

Calipers that do not carry a dust boot are also illegal for aussie roads

You mean the piston dust boot??? (My stock calipers did not have a dust boot over the caliper)
These HPA calipers have pistons with dust boots...outwardly no different to the stock caliper configuration

312mm OEM Setup you can go a 4 Pot Caliper from Porsche which for the "right" driver can easily be more than suited for track or road use.

I looked into Porsche calipers - they are getting a little hard to get and that's pushing the price up somewhat
(I objected to spending $2k on a brake kit with 10 year old calipers that have already done heaps of km)
I didn't want to buy rotors/calipers/adaptors separately - a little risky
I wanted a complete plug and play kit

The Porsche calipers protrude further towards the wheel spokes than the HPA Calipers
This may force the use spacers (legality issue) or buy different wheels - adding to the cost

and of course you want to keep that OEM brake feel always

No - I didn't want to keep the OEM brake feel (detailed previously) - but that's a personal taste/preferance issue

Both cars of ours (mk6 gti/s3) run this setup with a huge improvement

A huge improvement...but above you were saying a huge BBK wont give a massive improvement...

Don't always think bigger the better, theories and practise will tell you otherwise. Media and aesthetics make you want all .. Dont get me wrong, love 8 pot fronts, 4 pot rears.. but what for? (Yes they'd look nice lol)

When I earlier referred to myself as a "nutter" that was an ackowledgement that this BBK was totally excessive and not required

There were numerous BBK available in the 2K price range, most of them had ~330mm rotors and 4 pot calipers
I choose the kit with the largest rotor and 6 pot calipers (trying to get the most/best/biggest for same money) from a company with a known reputation working on VW & Audi

I really like this kit - it's lighter than the stock brakes, looks awesome, brake pedal feels excellent
(The rotors are not bedded in yet so I have not done any big stops)

[fuzion]

Martin,

Wow you have time on your hands lol. Nice reply!

Each to their own on what kits they want i agree definite.

FYI both my calipers and Lora's were brand new. Her's purchased last quarter of last year. So they are not that hard if you know where to look and they were not even close to that expense.

ps. you say legality issues for spacers. Your brakes also require certification to be "legally" fitted to the car. So contradiction there alone i would say for all of us for half the mods we fit actually!

We all worry about the weight, as you can really notice it and makes all the difference to the car. Don't include ones body weight that you may weigh 90kg and someone else in the 60s, or the fact you have heavy wheels and i don't? So realistically, its merely small numbers for peoples pants dyno and feeling overall.

But definitely agree with you, plug and play is great if you want an AIO solution at the end of the day. What kit you choose is each of course what they prefer and like, whether looks wise or specifications!

[Weekend-Warrior]

The Octavia VRS brake master cylinder has the same 23.8mm bore as the Audi S3

Martin, are you sure about that? That would mean it's different to the Mk5 GTi (22.22mm).

[Martin]

Martin, are you sure about that? That would mean it's different to the Mk5 GTi (22.22mm).

Yes, I've seen it in Skoda marketing material and spare parts descriptions
( Only for the higher end Octavia's - not the 90/118 )

Remember the MK5 is getting on now - 2006 to 2009
I'm finding my 2012 Octavia VRS much closer to MkVI GTI
I'll see if it's detailed in the Elsa workshop manual tonight

[Martin]

FYI both my calipers and Lora's were brand new. Her's purchased last quarter of last year. So they are not that hard if you know where to look and they were not even close to that expense.

Perhaps you could share some links???

ps. you say legality issues for spacers. Your brakes also require certification to be "legally" fitted to the car. So contradiction there alone i would say for all of us for half the mods we fit actually!

The spacer legality issue seems to be debated often in the forums - that's all I'm referring to
I disclosed the car modifications to my insurer (see my signature), they did not ask for any compliance or certifications
The ECU modification added $60 and the lot added ~$120 to my annual insurance cost
(My only concern is to ensure they can't refuse a claim on the basis of lack of disclosure)
Everybody has different sensitivities to the possible (legal and warranty) ramifications of modifications

But definitely agree with you, plug and play is great if you want an AIO solution at the end of the day. What kit you choose is each of course what they prefer and like, whether looks wise or specifications!

Yeah, for me the main thing to remember is it's not about need, it's all about want
As such we don't need to justify our car modifications to anybody other than our selves (and the finance minister)

Others who want also want to purchase a BBK often appreciate build threads and discovering pro's/con's of specific equipment
I think my HPA brake kit is rather rare in Australia and thought Octavia people would like to hear about it
At our Octavia drive we had 12 cars and only one had a BBK (from ECS Tuning)

I've certainly learnt a lot on this forum and really appreciated it
I've been out of touch with cars for over 10 years and can't believe how much cars have changed in that time
(I need to sit down and read the VCDS manual - there's so much to learn)

[Martin]

Martin, are you sure about that? That would mean it's different to the Mk5 GTi (22.22mm).

Coming back to this noteworthy point - I've now checked the workshop manual:

All Octavia's come with a master cylinder bore of 22.2mm except:
Petrol 147kw and TDI 125kw models which get a master cylinder with a 23.8mm bore

Specifically:

• Petrol engine codes BWA, CCZA
• Diesel engine codes BMN, CEGA

So yes these models are ahead of the MKV GTI
This positions these models well for multi piston caliper upgrades

As I said, my brake pedal feels great with the HPA 6 piston calipers, firm and granular control with heaps of authority