Shifting Techniques - Hybrid Double Clutching?

[jeddyb]

Hey, I've got a Mk4 1.6 petrol Golf with a five speed manual. I really like the car!

I just wanted to bounce a couple of ideas off of you guys in regards to manual shifting techniques.

I really like driving a stick shift and over time driving my Golf, I've put a lot of work into trying to develop my shifting techniques and I've pretty much got double de-clutching and heal-toeing down pat.

I'm aware that the transmission has synchronizers and double clutching isn't a necessity, but that doesn't mean it's not a good thing to learn, so, for the sake of extending the life of my clutch and the internal components of my transmission, I regularly employ these techniques.

Now for my question. It's to do with upshifting. When upshifting, if you keep the clutch disengaged throughout the whole shift, I would assume that the transmission would, just like when downshifting, put at least some load on the synchros to engage when the tranny isn't spinning at the correct speed. Now, again, I know it really isn't something that has to be done, but would I be right in assuming that engaging the clutch during an upshift to get the tranny spinning at the right speed would reduce some wear on the synchros, as well as making the actual engagement of the gears smoother? In my experience, I think I have found that using this kind of technique can actually reduce the amount of resistance in the transmission when shifting.

The only thing is, in my car at least, performing a full double clutch upshift will result in the engine revs falling too low before engaging the gear, unless you blip the throttle, which can be a bit annoying. So I've developed a bit of a hybrid technique that utilizes the advantages of both worlds.

Basically, when I go to upshift, I start by putting a very small amount of pressure on the gearstick towards the neutral position and then let off the gas. When the clutch is engaged and the transmission is under load, there is alot of resistance preventing the gear from disengaging, however I've found that if you supply a small amount of pressure before letting off the gas, there will be a split second where the transmission has zero load as the engine is moving from acceleration to deceleration and at this point the gear will slide right out with barely any effort, and will, in fact pull out easier than when the clutch is engaged. Then, just as the stick hits neutral, I dip the clutch to shift into the next gear. So this means that I get a smooth disengagement, plus the fact that the clutch is engaged for a short time while in neutral means I can usually also get a smoother engagement into the next gear and it all takes roughly the same amount of time as a typical upshift.

So, basically, I was curious to see what some of you guys thought about it and to see if you had any different perspectives, or if you actually do something similar.

[craig_the_german]

Hi jeddyb,

My advice would be that with any technique, be very careful with the gearbox. The 1.6L Manual box isn't the most robust around and many here (myself included) will testify they are hideously expensive to repair.

Get your shifts right and you'll have many years of fun driving ahead....get them wrong and you'll have a box full of bits

[jeddyb]

Hi jeddyb,

My advice would be that with any technique, be very careful with the gearbox. The 1.6L Manual box isn't the most robust around and many here (myself included) will testify they are hideously expensive to repair.

Get your shifts right and you'll have many years of fun driving ahead....get them wrong and you'll have a box full of bits

Great advice there!

I'm always gentle with my gearbox and after all, hopefully if I can develop my techniques enough, they should actually help to extend the life of the components.

I've already had to deal with a bad clutch. It must've been worn down pretty badly by the previous owner because it completely wore down and started breaking itself apart a couple of months after I bought it! It's all good now though, and so light!

I also don't generally drive very hard, but whenever I do give it a bit of extra gas, it's only once the engine's nice and warm and I usually take car not to force the transmission at all, if it doesn't want to come out of gear immediately, I just let it take it's time

[kendog]

My 2 cents:

Beware the 1.6L gearbox!!! I just had mine **** itself due to the inherent factory problems, didn't even last me a year. Reconditioned gearbox, installed $3100+ !! I thought it only happened to other people, I was a fool. Ticking time bomb. Beware.

[jeddyb]

My 2 cents:

Beware the 1.6L gearbox!!! I just had mine **** itself due to the inherent factory problems, didn't even last me a year. Reconditioned gearbox, installed $3100+ !! I thought it only happened to other people, I was a fool. Ticking time bomb. Beware.

Yikes! That's no good. Gotta bear in mind it's nearly a decade old though and a lot of those cars probably have to deal with a bit more than they're built for

Anyway, here's hoping mine is okay for another six months or so, because I'll be moving overseas next year.

[gringo_54_oval]

I change my gears without even pressing a clutch except when i take off obviously.

but when my slave cylinder pooped itself,i had to start in 2nd with the key bunny hop and drive home

[kendog]

Yikes! That's no good. Gotta bear in mind it's nearly a decade old though and a lot of those cars probably have to deal with a bit more than they're built for

Anyway, here's hoping mine is okay for another six months or so, because I'll be moving overseas next year.

OK, take it easy, make sure it's got good fluid levels! and hopefully you have no problems till you are done with it!

[GarryO]

Double clutching will not save your clutch, after all it is getting twice the use for a single shift.
And as others here have stated, getting it wrong can be expensive.
Back when I was young and a little less stupid I used to race rally, (nothing serious, just for fun)heel and toe braking is something you have to do to get the best entry speed and car setup for the exit, it doesn't translate into street driving unless you drive like you stole it, and the best thing for heel and toe braking is a set of adjustable pedals, sometimes you can jag a good setup, my wifes old 1990 bubble back Laser had great pedal setup, my Bora 4mo not so good.
With practice you can change up and down through the box with nothing more than a blip on the throttle with a synchro box, not something I would recommend practicing on with a car that your already trying to nurse the box on.

[GarryO]

Great advice there!

if it doesn't want to come out of gear immediately, I just let it take it's time

sounds like you already have problems.

[jeddyb]

The double clutching itself isn't to save the clutch per se, it's just to reduce wear on the synchronising components and get a smoother gear engagement.

I also know you don't need to heal toe when driving on the streets and I don't do it in the context that you're implying, that being driving fast. I simply use it as a means of not burning up my clutch whenever I have to downshift while braking, such as approaching a slow intersection, tight corner, etc.

Also, as far as that other comment, there's nothing wrong with the gearbox, just that when you've got maximum torque going through the gearbox, it has more resistance to coming out of gear, not that it won't come out, just that I'm not going to force it because it's not built for that kind of abuse.