Lift kit for T5 4 Motion - supplier?

[SvenOz]

So DIFFLOCK RETROFIT. - I have a dream.....

Had a look at this http://www.volkspage.net/technik/ssp/ssp/SSP_333.pdf (see p42+ for diff lock). Read it a couple of times (late at night, after some wines), and its not that hard, I thinks. Now, please note, this is my pondering, and I take no responsibility if someone does this and their van self destructs or otherwise. However, looks like this to me on the factory system, and below is my idea to retrofit and activate the system much more simply:
Factory system:
1. Difflock in rear, simple mechanical, nothing too different to any other on a Landy or Cruiser etc. By that, I mean how you turn it on and off etc, of course, this lock is not actually in the pumpkin like in a standard 4x4, but in the output shaft (right). Though there is a switch unit controller, I discuss below, which sits on the diff, and there are CAN BUS coms to the Haldex also discussed.
2. 3 switches in the locker control unit on the diff. Position 1, its off, and the light on the dash switch indicates this. Then switch it on, Vacuum actuated just like an ARB and the likes, and it 'requests' if the conditions are right (see below), which means if the conditions are right it attempts to engage it by vacuum activation. It cannot obviously lock until the teeth mesh. That is position 2, and tells you its requested. Then teeth mesh, it engages, and switch 3 in the controller is switched, and it now signals engaged, and the light on your dash switch changes to indicate this. This is all no surprises, and nothing new to anyone familiar with a standard diff lock on a 4x4.

That's the locking part. Not too complex, though a few more details to it.

Then there is the electronics, the testing conditions which need to be met before it will send a request, and maintained, and switching the Haldex (all the electronics). So uses ABS etc to check speed, etc, so can't turn it on if doing more than 45kmph, won't stay on over 45, or if too much speed difference between the wheels (7kph diff), etc etc, all so that its idiot proof, as that is who would get their hands on some of these.

So I was thinking,....... if your not an idiot, ......and can deal with the diff lock like an old school (ARB and the likes), ......and use a bit of common nouse, and not turn it on when you are doing 100 down the freeway and round a bend, whilst juggling your latte and pastry (each of which I am partial to, but not whilst driving), etc, then would this not work?:

1. swap diff for one with a locker in it. simple unbolt, swap, bolt back in, just need those special VW AZX?? tools or whatever they are called that are sitting in my van right now, and a torque wrench. Could have done that in the garage with my dad when I was 12, although the vans did not exist back then. Much easier than helping swapping diffs and axle shafts etc on dads car in the day, or on my kingswood later, and later on rebuilding blown up engines, transmission swaps (including a bloody Transaxle swap and new clutch, all crawling under the car with the car on axle stands on a Renault that was a job. Those transmissions are a bugger to lift and instal on your own) etc in my younger days.

2. Buy the vacuum activation unit (see details in the link). Or, make your own. Not too hard to do that, with a few solenoids off eBay. VW have perhaps inadvertently, helped out and even tell you the part numbers.

3. Couple of relays so that the 'request' will not work unless the handbrake is on (easy enough with the correct relays rigged up to 12v constant, and a relay also to the handbrake. Can't remember the correct names but think they are called 'latching relays for the later', but some relays act as a switch when powered and switch back straight away when off, and some only need to be powered when switched on, then latch in that position. put one of each of those in with the handbrake signal, and should be that can't turn the locker on or off without putting on the handbrake first (in case someone who does not know your van drives it). Or, you could go even older school, and not bother with that safety addition. Add a nice flashing LED or even buzzer to indicate its on, and a little warning label so unknown persons (eg, your mechanic, or pink slip tester, or Mr grand theft auto) are told by flashing light not to drive on bitumen with the locker on (repeat pastry juggling etc, or perhaps a couple of burbons if its Mr grand theft auto), just to be on the safe side.

4. That should get the locker going on the mechanical side. ABS signals etc I read as not needed then for that, particularly making the switching handbrake dependent.

5. BUT, this still means that you are still predominantly in 2wd, so locker of no use unless your front/rear travel at diff speeds etc. That though is when you mainly need it. However, to make it better, would not a Haldex piggyback controller work on this???? Many available in Europe for Golfs, and maybe Transporter??. Simply override the standard signal and tell the unit to have a full 100% lock, (ie, 50/50 split in power to the rear). Could be a manual switching on this, or perhaps some can be programmed so that your locker 'switched on' indicator then automatically switches the Haldex. Maybe an Arduino unit to control it all if you want to get really fancy?

BINGO, we have a winner! A locker retro fit, runs a lot like a factory fit, just enough safety measures, but the main difference being no need to tell the van its there. No ECU modification, reprogramming, activating the option, etc, etc, as long as you can get your hands on a diff with a lock, a little handy with some very basic electronics (Oh, did I mention that was a teenage interest of mine) and vacuum plumbing. Or who was that talented guy who retrofitted the actual mechanicals into his non-locker diff?????? Maybe we should pay each other a visit??

[SvenOz]

PS. Its not that hard to fit the genuine Fiamma awning brackets to the van (as I've done) to then fit with a Reimo pop top for any roll out awning without having to drill a single whole in the vehicle like many others are doing, or having to fit the Reimo rail or other similar device, all needing drilling of multiple holes in your van, and encouraging rust. One awning fitted, no holes drilled! See earlier photo.

[SvenOz]

So on the King Springs that some are discussing, so you know, I went to a suspension specialist for a lift on mine. Come back, Kings in it, and its had a drop! SO these (name not mentioned) guys did lifts on a lot of T5s and should know their business. I had just bought the van ,and clearly did not. I knew it had factory fitted Rough Road springs when new, so was expecting it to be higher than a standard (as it was, and I'd read that was 10mm - 20mm but VW were always vague on the details), and it was basically an empty Transporter, so again expecting it to sit relatively high. But I thought the Kings would make it more so. The Seikel are apparently not just a lift by being stiffer (apparently that's how Kings do it), but are longer, and thus, the standard Desert are actually softer than the Kings, and more flex/comfort, yet still more lift, As I found out.

I found out at that point the drop was because the van already had the Seikel kit in it (probably fitted later than purchase). So, the extra heavy duty Kings are still visually noticably lower than the basic Seikel Desert, noticeable even without getting out the tape measure, though prior photos with tape measure convinced the suspension shop that I did not have rocks in my head, then they pulled out the old springs, and sure enough, Seikel (and Einbach) written on every spring. The difference is particularly on the front end. If you go for the Seikel extra heavy duty ones, its even more so on the rear. Mine has the Seikel basic (Desert), plus PolyAirbags in the rear now (I added) for when needed, so its a bit nicer to drive round town as the Maxi I have heard you should not install unless you always have at least 500Kg in the rear, as are too hard. Trakka use the Maxi, and so they should with the weight in their vans.

Its possible to get specially longer Bilstein B6's for your rear if you do go to the Kings, and apparently, standard Bilstein B6s for the font are long enough as they cope with the full droop anyway, and the lift does not ad more droop. This is how the Ambos have been set up, with Bilstein B6's, rears specially made for them (but available if you ask the right people) and standard B6s on front, and Kings, plus diff spacers, basically copied from Seikel. Still significantly lower than the Seikel, and many have said the Kings are too hard. Personally, mine never left the workshop when the Kings were put in it, as the Seikel were promptly put back in.

Realistically, given the price of the Bilsteins or Munro shocks, and the Kings, I would recommend springing the extra (see my earlier post at page 21), and getting the Seikel from Trakka (if you want an Australian supplier, they will supply, but when I contacted them, they were not interested fitting as can't keep up with their van orders), or its a bit cheaper if you buy from Seikel direct, as they will now post out to you. Just remember to remind them that as they are shipping out of the country, they can charge you EX VAT price (their equiv of GST), and then you probably pay GST on import to AUS. They may need reminding/convincing that they don't have to charge you the VAT when shipping OS, as when I was enquiring, I had to explain that one to them, but they eventually were surprised that I was correct, and agreed.

Oh, when I was looking for setup, I contacted Seikel, and discussed what is best with a circa 300kg load at all times as was concerned the Maxi was too hard. They advised they can (though not listed) supply the Desert kit with some spacers for the rear (15mm I think) as well to give some extra lift in the rear, yet still have the benefit of the softer springs. Alternately, you can put in airbags as well as the springs like I have done, which means you can leave in however much air you need, and change the height (pressure) as needed when adding, removing weight. This is a more expensive option than the spaces, but was something like extra $600 supply and fit if they are already taking your suspension apart.

[jonathan_k]

Sweet setup Sven, can you do a build thread on your setup? It sounds like you've got some great interior options.

I'm keen to see how you setup the straps for fitting the boards into the roof.

[MAD]

So DIFFLOCK RETROFIT. - I have a dream.....

Had a look at this http://www.volkspage.net/technik/ssp/ssp/SSP_333.pdf (see p42+ for diff lock). Read it a couple of times (late at night, after some wines), and its not that hard, I thinks. Now, please note, this is my pondering, and I take no responsibility if someone does this and their van self destructs or otherwise. However, looks like this to me on the factory system, and below is my idea to retrofit and activate the system much more simply:
Factory system:
1. Difflock in rear, simple mechanical, nothing too different to any other on a Landy or Cruiser etc. By that, I mean how you turn it on and off etc, of course, this lock is not actually in the pumpkin like in a standard 4x4, but in the output shaft (right). Though there is a switch unit controller, I discuss below, which sits on the diff, and there are CAN BUS coms to the Haldex also discussed.
2. 3 switches in the locker control unit on the diff. Position 1, its off, and the light on the dash switch indicates this. Then switch it on, Vacuum actuated just like an ARB and the likes, and it 'requests' if the conditions are right (see below), which means if the conditions are right it attempts to engage it by vacuum activation. It cannot obviously lock until the teeth mesh. That is position 2, and tells you its requested. Then teeth mesh, it engages, and switch 3 in the controller is switched, and it now signals engaged, and the light on your dash switch changes to indicate this. This is all no surprises, and nothing new to anyone familiar with a standard diff lock on a 4x4.

That's the locking part. Not too complex, though a few more details to it.

Then there is the electronics, the testing conditions which need to be met before it will send a request, and maintained, and switching the Haldex (all the electronics). So uses ABS etc to check speed, etc, so can't turn it on if doing more than 45kmph, won't stay on over 45, or if too much speed difference between the wheels (7kph diff), etc etc, all so that its idiot proof, as that is who would get their hands on some of these.

So I was thinking,....... if your not an idiot, ......and can deal with the diff lock like an old school (ARB and the likes), ......and use a bit of common nouse, and not turn it on when you are doing 100 down the freeway and round a bend, whilst juggling your latte and pastry (each of which I am partial to, but not whilst driving), etc, then would this not work?:

1. swap diff for one with a locker in it. simple unbolt, swap, bolt back in, just need those special VW AZX?? tools or whatever they are called that are sitting in my van right now, and a torque wrench. Could have done that in the garage with my dad when I was 12, although the vans did not exist back then. Much easier than helping swapping diffs and axle shafts etc on dads car in the day, or on my kingswood later, and later on rebuilding blown up engines, transmission swaps (including a bloody Transaxle swap and new clutch, all crawling under the car with the car on axle stands on a Renault that was a job. Those transmissions are a bugger to lift and instal on your own) etc in my younger days.

2. Buy the vacuum activation unit (see details in the link). Or, make your own. Not too hard to do that, with a few solenoids off eBay. VW have perhaps inadvertently, helped out and even tell you the part numbers.

3. Couple of relays so that the 'request' will not work unless the handbrake is on (easy enough with the correct relays rigged up to 12v constant, and a relay also to the handbrake. Can't remember the correct names but think they are called 'latching relays for the later', but some relays act as a switch when powered and switch back straight away when off, and some only need to be powered when switched on, then latch in that position. put one of each of those in with the handbrake signal, and should be that can't turn the locker on or off without putting on the handbrake first (in case someone who does not know your van drives it). Or, you could go even older school, and not bother with that safety addition. Add a nice flashing LED or even buzzer to indicate its on, and a little warning label so unknown persons (eg, your mechanic, or pink slip tester, or Mr grand theft auto) are told by flashing light not to drive on bitumen with the locker on (repeat pastry juggling etc, or perhaps a couple of burbons if its Mr grand theft auto), just to be on the safe side.

4. That should get the locker going on the mechanical side. ABS signals etc I read as not needed then for that, particularly making the switching handbrake dependent.

5. BUT, this still means that you are still predominantly in 2wd, so locker of no use unless your front/rear travel at diff speeds etc. That though is when you mainly need it. However, to make it better, would not a Haldex piggyback controller work on this???? Many available in Europe for Golfs, and maybe Transporter??. Simply override the standard signal and tell the unit to have a full 100% lock, (ie, 50/50 split in power to the rear). Could be a manual switching on this, or perhaps some can be programmed so that your locker 'switched on' indicator then automatically switches the Haldex. Maybe an Arduino unit to control it all if you want to get really fancy?

BINGO, we have a winner! A locker retro fit, runs a lot like a factory fit, just enough safety measures, but the main difference being no need to tell the van its there. No ECU modification, reprogramming, activating the option, etc, etc, as long as you can get your hands on a diff with a lock, a little handy with some very basic electronics (Oh, did I mention that was a teenage interest of mine) and vacuum plumbing. Or who was that talented guy who retrofitted the actual mechanicals into his non-locker diff?????? Maybe we should pay each other a visit??

Hey SvenOz,
Dude Where are you located we need to talk about all your posts as I've done extremely similar re boxes, water tank, charging systems, suspension , difflock + a lot more still have a bit to do, would be good to discuss a few things as I have a lot of information on all aspects and would love discussing it with you,

I'm in Vic

Regards
Mad

[lance5525]

Has anyone done this recently? I’ve read all the old posts and contacted seikel who advised me I had to go through trakka and their kit is $3800 installed but not including shipping costs of the kit. Which seems quite pricey.

What’s in the seikel kit that can’t be bought in Australia from an Aussie company? Sorry I don’t have much knowledge in this area.

[Bryn23]

I believe the diff spacers to keep the CV angles in range, but then they can be sorted from getting them on eBay.

A lot of guys here have just used King springs to get height and not worried about possible CV issues and seem to be happy with them

[lance5525]

I believe the diff spacers to keep the CV angles in range, but then they can be sorted from getting them on eBay.

A lot of guys here have just used King springs to get height and not worried about possible CV issues and seem to be happy with them

T

Thanks mate, I'll have a look on ebay and see what I can sort out

[lance5525]

I can't seem to find them, can anyone point me in the right direction please.

Are King springs the best option for lift and off road (sand) driving? What's the ideal set up? Should I be adding better Shocks as well? Ie the Koni Special actives available in the Seikel kit?

Is there any other mods that will help my T5 off road?

[Transporter]

The King springs and HD shocks at the back did the job for me - improved the departure angle actually in my case that was approach angle since I reverse into the driveways every day.
Similarly the diff spacers and lift kit will raise the body only. To increase the ground clearance you should also fit larger diameter tyres if you think about really going off-roading.