the swallow tail project has begun.......

[peedman]

Ur not the only one jarred lol. i followed the vortex links and i think these are what rocco is talking about:




http://www.pmwltd.com/index.php

[alex g]

yep rethink, sat down and drew it out a few times and low and behold the ball joint was always in the same spot, and the arch it traveled was the same, will have to tackle this like everybody else by spacing the balljoint from the hub not the control arm

and a big thanks to grant for posting and preaching some good info

[roccodingo]

Its all about learning guy's. and keeping it safe for you and everyone else.

[Preen59]

That's a good write up Grant. You should consider posting that in wheels and suspension i reckon.

I found it easy to understand, but i guess it is quite involved for "beginners". It would be easier to understand if you had some diagrams. I'm thinking I could draw it up in AutoCAD and show people the arc for the control arm versus the pivot points etc but there's probably something out there on the interhighway about it already.





Wirecut.. Nice!

[roccodingo]

Found this on Vortex, just need them for the Mk 1 suspension now..

http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=4431840

[static1800]

If you guys want to organise a write up for it that would be great, can sticky it in the suspension forum. That is the kind of info we want to have around, very useful.

[Preen59]

If you guys want to organise a write up for it that would be great, can sticky it in the suspension forum. That is the kind of info we want to have around, very useful.

Righto give me some time and i'll do it this arvo.. The drawing that is.

[Jarred]

did some reading on the tex, and it seems these babies (for a mk 3 atleast) will set you back about 265USD a pair. (at 04/0 Then you'll need a tie rod flip kit too, since they work in unison with each other. and a lowered car, but that's a given if you're looking at buying these anyways.

[alex g]

yer they are the cheaper of the two available designs, just seems a bit pricey, but they are made and designed top notch .seems to be the easiest option

[sports racer]

For those of you who have problems visualising how bump steer works go out and find an old car somewhere and bounce the front end (old Hot Rods are great to do this to because they usually are built for looks with no idea how the suspension works - just don't let the owner catch you!). As the car is bouncing up and down have a look at the front wheels and how they change direction. Most modern cars keep the wheels pointing the same direction but on some cars the wheels will toe in or out. Because the wheels aren't parallel it means the front tyres are fighting each other for traction as they both want to point in different directions. Not very good for cornering.

I used to have a Bolwell Nagari (there's one in Carpoint for those of you who have no idea what they are) and it was a pig to drive. On bumpy sweeping corners it would be a real handful to drive fast and I would always be moving the steering wheel left and right about 7cm to balance the steering as the front tyres fought over who was going to do the steering. At slower speeds it wasn't too much of a problem as the 60 profile tyres were distorting slightly to compensate.

Eventually the lightbulb came on and I jacked up the front, took off the wheels and coilovers and tied broom handles to both hubs so they were parallel to the sides of the car. Then I moved the hubs up and down through their full arc and noticed where the broom handles were pointing. As the hubs went up the handles started pointing away from the car so I relocated the rack about 8cm higher so the tie rod ends were parallel to the lower wishbones. It was a little bit more measuring than that but the broom handles eventually were parallel for nearly the entire up/down movement of the front suspension. The end result was a car I could take to Oran Park and do pretty good lap times or (in theory as this is a responsible site) sit on 250ks down the old Hume Highway, corners, bumps, radar traps and all.

Getting bump steer down to zero (or pretty close) is well worth the effort involved.

Hope I haven't confused you too much.

Cheers

Paul