golf R

**Sharkie** · 17-04-2009, 05:25 AM

Originally Posted by limmy

plus S3 figures is based on manual...so you can safely say DSG will be quicker too...

Not necessarily..... VW have always made big performance noises about DSG being quicker than a manual. And it does change gears quicker than a manual and in VW's tests .... starting the clock when the car starts moving it has been quicker ....

HOWEVER when VW took the press to a drag strip to "prove" their claims the manuals beat the DSGs over the qrtr every single time ........

(I can provide a link to the press report on this)

That bit of lag (and the press still reports on this in every test and I experienced it on a recent testdrive of the Q5) of a DSG upon pull-off when the lights turn green means the manual is gone ......

SO timed against the clock from when movement starts ... yes a DSG is quicker

BUT timed on a drag strip, the manuals still beat the DSGs .... PROVIDED the driver knows what he is doing as the DSG allows even tools to shift quickly

Either way, I'm comfortable that the R20T/whatever will do it in a time around 5.7s ...

... and that is before I let the tuners near it .....

**pologti18t** · 17-04-2009, 09:42 AM

FSI = Direct Injection normally aspirated.

TSI = the new range of turbo, turbo+supercharged engines.

**gregozedobe** · 17-04-2009, 07:05 PM

Originally Posted by pologti18t

FSI = Direct Injection normally aspirated.

TSI = the new range of turbo, turbo+supercharged engines.

And if they ever put a straight supercharged motor (a la Audi's latest V6) into a Golf, then it will probably also have a TSI badge, just to keep the marketing boffins happy

**hokenmk3** · 17-04-2009, 11:30 PM

Originally Posted by gregozedobe

And if they ever put a straight supercharged motor (a la Audi's latest V6) into a Golf, then it will probably also have a TSI badge, just to keep the marketing boffins happy

The letters F, T, S and I have specific meanings. I have explained them in this thread. The 1.4 GT has a turbo motor. The supercharger is like the first turbo in a twin turbo and only for reducing turbo lag and helping an earlier spool up. It is a "twin charger" system. If a VW had a supercharger and no turbocharger, it wouldn't get the T. VW don't flippantly throw letters and numbers together like bimmer does. They are intended to inform the buyer of which technologies the vehicles possess. Knowing what a boffin is might help one's fear of acronyms.

**gregozedobe** · 18-04-2009, 01:22 AM

Originally Posted by hokenmk3

VW don't flippantly throw letters and numbers together like bimmer does. They are intended to inform the buyer of which technologies the vehicles possess.

Your faith in the accuracy and integrity of the VW organisation is both admirable and heart warming, unfortunately the empirical evidence tells a different story

Until recently VW was using the TSI acronym only on the 1.4 GT engine (the "twincharger" one with with both a turbo and a supercharger), and TFSI for the 2.0 petrol engine with a turbo. These days both engines get the TSI acronym (as does the new cam chain driven version of the 2.0 turbo petrol).

For another example, look at the usage of the words "Bluetec", "BlueMotion" and "Adblue" in association with VW models being marketed as having superior fuel economy and/or emissions control).

If a VW had a supercharger and no turbocharger, it wouldn't get the T.

Sorry, not always (don't you just hate those annoying exceptions to the "rules" ) - the "VW Touareg V6 TSI Hybrid" - has, wait for it..... a supercharged V6 (and, unfortunately for your theory, nary a Turbo to be seen).

And just to be different, it seems Audi are marketing their version of the 3.0 V6 supercharged (ie no turbo) engine under the "TFSI" banner.

So until I see convincing evidence to the contrary, you can see why I will continue to hold the opinion that (unfortunately) those pesky marketing boffins have more say in this matter than the engineers and engine designers at VW.

**hokenmk3** · 18-04-2009, 05:50 PM

Originally Posted by gregozedobe

These days both engines get the TSI acronym (as does the new cam chain driven version of the 2.0 turbo petrol).

Sorry, not always (don't you just hate those annoying exceptions to the "rules" ) - the "VW Touareg V6 TSI Hybrid" - has, wait for it..... a supercharged V6 (and, unfortunately for your theory, nary a Turbo to be seen).

And just to be different, it seems Audi are marketing their version of the 3.0 V6 supercharged (ie no turbo) engine under the "TFSI" banner.

So until I see convincing evidence to the contrary, you can see why I will continue to hold the opinion that (unfortunately) those pesky marketing boffins have more say in this matter than the engineers and engine designers at VW.

Fair enough. Your point is valid. It does seem that the VW marketing division has decided to cash in on the cliche of TFSI. They still have throttle-plated manifolds and are charged by a compressor rather than a roller so it is still describing the vehicle's tech. VW own Audi, Porsche, Lamborghini and the off shoots (as I'm sure you are aware) so in these difficult times of reduced new vehicle sales, marketing needs to squeeze their past success for every ounce it's worth.

SI makes a cool noise with an airpod!

**limmy** · 18-04-2009, 09:15 PM

sharkie - would be interested to see this link you speak of. did they use launch control?

my point being - i still think the R20 will be quicker than the current S3.

Originally Posted by Sharkie

...

HOWEVER when VW took the press to a drag strip to "prove" their claims the manuals beat the DSGs over the qrtr every single time ........

(I can provide a link to the press report on this)

**tdi guy** · 18-04-2009, 10:30 PM

Originally Posted by Sharkie

HOWEVER when VW took the press to a drag strip to "prove" their claims the manuals beat the DSGs over the qrtr every single time ........

(I can provide a link to the press report on this)

That bit of lag (and the press still reports on this in every test and I experienced it on a recent testdrive of the Q5) of a DSG upon pull-off when the lights turn green means the manual is gone ......

Doesn't launch control overcome the lag by pre-selecting 1st and engaging the clutches?

TG

**Sharkie** · 19-04-2009, 05:25 AM

Yeah, I also believe R20T will be quicker than S3 ... both manual or DSG.

VW developed launch control in response to the embarrassement at the drag day ...... which improved things immensely but still don't match a properly driven manual on the strip. I'll find the link and post up.

However, you can't go around and use launch control every time you stop at a set of lights so the hesitation will still be there ....

... Some say you get used to it .... I won't though.

EDIT: found the link .... http://www.motoring.co.za/index.php?...icleId=2470517

**Zed!** · 20-04-2009, 03:23 PM

Originally Posted by Sharkie

Yeah, I also believe R20T will be quicker than S3 ... both manual or DSG.

VW developed launch control in response to the embarrassement at the drag day ...... which improved things immensely but still don't match a properly driven manual on the strip. I'll find the link and post up.

However, you can't go around and use launch control every time you stop at a set of lights so the hesitation will still be there ....

... Some say you get used to it .... I won't though.

EDIT: found the link .... http://www.motoring.co.za/index.php?...icleId=2470517

Yeah if i wanted a traffic light dragster I wouldn't have opted for a DSG.