Depress Clutch to Start - Manual cars

[Mi16 Man]

I reckon they should change the name of this forum to VWWW VW Watercooled Whingers.

Strike me pink, VAG put a safety device in a car (one that makes good sense) and people complain about it, no doubt if it were not fitted, people would complain about that too.

Get a life guys, if this is a major bone of contention, go buy a car that doesn't have this feature and then complain about all the good features in VWs that are missing on the ToyoForMitHold whatever it is you buy.



Cheers

George

Ha! It's ok George......

All I asked was if a switch could be realistically bypassed.....look what ensued.....

Now, back to the show. Pass me the popcorn, please.....

[Transporter]

I reckon they should change the name of this forum to VWWW VW Watercooled Whingers.

Strike me pink, VAG put a safety device in a car (one that makes good sense) and people complain about it, no doubt if it were not fitted, people would complain about that too.

Get a life guys, if this is a major bone of contention, go buy a car that doesn't have this feature and then complain about all the good features in VWs that are missing on the ToyoForMitHold whatever it is you buy.



Cheers

George

Chery.

[spellbound]

And you know, not all of what is now mandated necessarily makes cars safer. I remember a British driving instructor saying that he wished every car had a dagger where the steering wheel air bag was. Drivers would try and make sure that it never deployed. An air bag on the other hand sounds soft and welcoming (until you see the damage one can actually do), and so some drivers take additional risks believing they will have a soft pillow to protect them. The same for things like ESP, ABS, TCS, and the like. Instead of teaching drivers how to avoid getting into such situations (you notice I did not say how to get out of situations as to teach you how to get out of them you have to teach them how to get into them in the first place), we have technology to nanny you. These features are great, once you have learned to drive properly. It also causes issues when you get into a car without them. Can you imagine licences where it is not just endorsed for manual or automatic, but also ESP, ABS, TCS, etc!

Very true about the air bag , my partener got her 206gti written off in april , still has chest injuries from the air bag , looked like an aubergine for 6 weeks , but it saved her life .

Not a good feeling being hit by an 80's skyline at 85k+ head on in a suburban road .

[Captain Courteous]

Chery.

Lol... Don't forget 'Great' Wall.

[MkVIGTI]

Lol... Don't forget 'Great' Wall.

Hyundai and Kia are like that not long ago, I think it's only a matter of time before the Chinese made cars catch up

[sillywet]

haha that's epic. George, were you just trawling the forum for somewhere to unleash? It seems your current car is sans-clutch pedal anyway?

wai - the dagger in the airbag comment is a cracker. my old man's old S4 (the big one based on the 100 series) used to have this cable arrangement where in a front end prang the steering column would essentially pulls itself up and out of the way. Yet because it was destined for the US, they had to instal an airbag too. So basically the airbag would have cushioned the impact for nothing more than the roof lining.

[brad]

I was always taught to depress the clutch to remove the drag of the gearbox from the starting process (geez the starter motors must have been weak back then!!!).

Friend of mine got a manual Outback (years ago) for her company car. One of the conditions was it was also a pool car for her employer (who suggested she buy an automatic). You wouldn't believe how many numpties put it into the wall because they didn't depress the clutch on start-up.

[wai]

I was always taught to depress the clutch to remove the drag of the gearbox from the starting process (geez the starter motors must have been weak back then!!!).

I was taught to have the transmission in neutral and the clutch pedal out to reduce the drag of the gearbox! With the car in gear and the clutch pedal depressed, there is more drag than with the clutch out and the transmission in neutral.

I know that on my Mini (the original real one), and my Hiace, when stationary and in neutral and then engaging 1st, you could hear and feel the transmission engage, even with the clutch pedal fully depressed. Not enough to drive the cars, but enough drag to be noticed.

With the clutch pedal depressed, there is the friction of the throw out bearing to consider. It is not much, and in the grand scheme of things nothing to write home about.

What started this is why should the driver be required to depress the clutch pedal, even with the transmission in neutral. Even manual cars these days will have a gear position indicator so they have the switchgear to know what gear they are in. All it needs is a relatively simple change in the logic where the clutch only needs to be depressed when you try to start the engine AND the transmission is not in neutral.

I have to say that in the 35+ years of driving and having owned and driven a number of different cars ranging from an XM Falcon (manual), right through to my Hiace (can't include the Caddy as it will not let me start unless the foot brake is depressed even if the transmission is in neutral or park!), I have NEVER been able to fully start the engine with the manual transmission in gear and the clutch out, or in an automatic with the transmission in drive or reverse. In the manual cars, yes, it would bunny hop, but not for more than a foot or so (not even one complete revolution of the wheel). In automatics, the engine would whirr away (very slowly) trying to start, but the car would not move and the engine would not fire up.

Again, it is up to VW, but chances are they will not change a thing. They have not done this with other matters that are more important so I would not hold my breath.

[brad]

In automatics, the engine would whirr away (very slowly) trying to start, but the car would not move and the engine would not fire up.

Which automatic allows the starter motor to work when the selector isn't in P or N?

[Corey_R]

The DSG can be started in D... but only if the motor is switched off in D.

As the DSG isn't a "real" automatic (torque converter), the engine has to be running to get it into P. So if you accidently turn off the engine whilst in D, or for some reason your car is stalled, it will let you start it again in D. I have only had to do this once, and I wasn't in a position to risk seeing whether it would let me start it without the brake on or not. The DSG gearbox portion is mechanically a manual gearbox, so theoretically the clutch is probably "in" so it wouldn't move anyway. But then, no idea whether or not it needs engine power to engage/disengage the clutch etc. If it did need the engine on to operate the clutch packs, then I guess the clutch state would then still be the same as when the power was cut...