Delay on take-off (DSG)

[Dubya]

lol - nah - that was me typing quickly during a lunch break from a source where all the text was in "pictures" and therefore not copy and pasteable. I'd fix it up, but everyone here is intelligent enough to understand the post and that my comments are correct.

Thanks for confirming that your own comments are correct. Most reassuring!

[cameronp]

I noticed when driving to work today that the DSG would get into gear and keep the clutch at the ready if you're "riding the brake". That is, rather than having your foot firmly on the brake, rest it just barely enough to stop the car. Lifting my foot off the brake at this point would result in the car creeping forward immediately, even up a moderately steep hill, just as it would in a traditional automatic.

So if I wasn't deluding myself this morning, there's two lessons here: if you value your transmission's life span, keep your foot firmly on the brake when you're stopped at the lights. But if you want to be ready to take off in a hurry, try lifting your foot a little way off the brake a little while you're stopped. You can hear a quiet "click" as the DSG changes into gear, and also feel the clutch reach the friction point.

[jj77]

I noticed when driving to work today that the DSG would get into gear and keep the clutch at the ready if you're "riding the brake". That is, rather than having your foot firmly on the brake, rest it just barely enough to stop the car. Lifting my foot off the brake at this point would result in the car creeping forward immediately, even up a moderately steep hill, just as it would in a traditional automatic.

So if I wasn't deluding myself this morning, there's two lessons here: if you value your transmission's life span, keep your foot firmly on the brake when you're stopped at the lights. But if you want to be ready to take off in a hurry, try lifting your foot a little way off the brake a little while you're stopped. You can hear a quiet "click" as the DSG changes into gear, and also feel the clutch reach the friction point.

Thanks for the information, cameronp. My Golf is less than 300km year-old and I was thinking I will get used to the lag. But at the same I felt frustrated when I really have to quickly squeeze in the traffic at the stop sign or traffic lights knowing that I might not be able to successfully "shoot out" :p

I know little about inner working systems of cars... would you mind educating me how much damage I would do to the transmission if I do half-way brake regularly?

Many thanks in advance.
Cheers,
J

[Corey_R]

I know little about inner working systems of cars... would you mind educating me how much damage I would do to the transmission if I do half-way brake regularly?

You'd likely wear the clutch out quicker. There is also chance that if you do it too much in succession (in the same trip), that the DSG might put itself into "limp mode" (or whatever it's called) where it tries to protect the clutches if they're getting too warm etc.

[galtaforce]

I noticed when driving to work today that the DSG would get into gear and keep the clutch at the ready if you're "riding the brake". That is, rather than having your foot firmly on the brake, rest it just barely enough to stop the car. Lifting my foot off the brake at this point would result in the car creeping forward immediately, even up a moderately steep hill, just as it would in a traditional automatic.

Just on that point... my car always begins to move forwards when I come off the brake no matter how much pressure I have been using to keep it still. My understanding was that the clutches weren't supposed to engage until you pressed on the accelerator yet they seem to engage the moment the brake is off. Is this similar to other peoples' experiences?

[prise]

The wet plate clutch on the six speed is lightly engaged with brake on in drive. It's one of the benefits of a wet plate clutch - the viscosity off the oil is transmitting the torque in that condition so wear is not a problem.

[galtaforce]

The wet plate clutch on the six speed is lightly engaged with brake on in drive. It's one of the benefits of a wet plate clutch - the viscosity off the oil is transmitting the torque in that condition so wear is not a problem.

Ah, of course. I drove a new Passat CC which only seemed to engage the clutch when you accelerated slightly (in contrast to my GTI). Is this because the Passat has the new dry clutch DSG?

[jj77]

You'd likely wear the clutch out quicker. There is also chance that if you do it too much in succession (in the same trip), that the DSG might put itself into "limp mode" (or whatever it's called) where it tries to protect the clutches if they're getting too warm etc.

Thanks, coreying for your prompt response - much appreciated. I will definitely keep my foot firmly on the brake when I'm at the lights!

Cheers,
J

[cameronp]

I noticed when driving to work today that the DSG would get into gear and keep the clutch at the ready if you're "riding the brake". That is, rather than having your foot firmly on the brake, rest it just barely enough to stop the car. Lifting my foot off the brake at this point would result in the car creeping forward immediately, even up a moderately steep hill, just as it would in a traditional automatic.

So if I wasn't deluding myself this morning, there's two lessons here: if you value your transmission's life span, keep your foot firmly on the brake when you're stopped at the lights. But if you want to be ready to take off in a hurry, try lifting your foot a little way off the brake a little while you're stopped. You can hear a quiet "click" as the DSG changes into gear, and also feel the clutch reach the friction point.

After experimenting further this evening, I think I was jumping to conclusions. The closest I was able to get to this morning's behaviour was almost-immediate crawl speeds when lifting off the brake. Moving from crawl into actual acceleration still had a small lag. I guess that means that low-speed crawl isn't as simple as the DSG just gradually releasing the clutch in first gear. It's possible that this morning either hills or the fact that I'd already been moving slowly - spending only a short time stationary before moving up another couple of car lengths - was what made the difference. Dunno. I'm almost but not quite nerdy enough to buy a VAG-COM to investigate this further. VW have obviously put a lot of effort into this gearbox; sometimes it works really well, and sometimes it just seems too clever for its own good.

I also had the first experience that made me wish I'd been driving a manual tonight: trying to reverse up a friend's narrow driveway on a hill. Out of concern that I'd either hit her car or her fence, I ended up parking on the street instead. The crawl/hill-hold behaviour on the DSG was quite erratic, and it was difficult to get precise control over the car's speed using the accelerator and brake.

[logger]

I'm almost but not quite nerdy enough to buy a VAG-COM to investigate this further.

I was/am nerdy enough
Take a look at DSG7 data log thread I did last year. Some interesting stuff there if you have not already seen it.

For example when you start off, the k1 clutch never actually fully engages 1st gear, (continually slips the clutch) until the gearbox engages k2 and second gear.

VCDS VAG-COM is now shipping with the label files I made for the DSG7 and CAV engine